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UK leave or remain in the EU ?

By Black Adder
6/11/2016 3:27 am

Just curious to see/hear what people on here think/expect this vote to be.

I fully understand most people on here are from the states,but as your President has recently told us Brits how we should all vote,I wondered if you all agree with him.

This question is partially asked, as in a FOF MP League a few years ago, an american guy had seen a tv show on Tony Blair and stated he`d be well thought of in future years.

He was told a few home truths from fellow Brits on there,exactly what they thought of Mr Blair and his leadership.

Re: UK leave or remain in the EU ?

By WarEagle
6/11/2016 6:48 am
Black Adder wrote:

...as your President has recently told us Brits how we should all vote,I wondered if you all agree with him.


On this only.

I've always thought if you don't bother to vote, you shouldn't bother to complain.

Re: UK leave or remain in the EU ?

By jgcruz
6/11/2016 9:48 am
Black Adder wrote:
...as your President has recently told us Brits how we should all vote,I wondered if you all agree with him..


No, but then I hardly agree with him on anything.

Re: UK leave or remain in the EU ?

By WarEagle
6/11/2016 9:55 am
WarEagle wrote:
Black Adder wrote:

...as your President has recently told us Brits how we should all vote,I wondered if you all agree with him.


On this only.

I've always thought if you don't bother to vote, you shouldn't bother to complain.


Let me clarify, I meant that I thought you should vote, not that I have an opinion on which way you should vote.

Re: UK leave or remain in the EU ?

By Gustoon
6/11/2016 4:04 pm
Mr Obama should really have kept those comments to himself, but understand WHY he made them as some current rates that the UK and USA have are preferable, should we leave that will change to the Us's detriment.

With regard to in or out..... I have yet to hear ANYTHING concrete from the out camp that makes me want to vote 'out'. All it is is pure speculation, what else could there be?

Is being in Europe really that bad and worth the gamble? The decisions we make now will affect our children and theres after which is why I'll be voting to remain.

Re: UK leave or remain in the EU ?

By Rumplebeanskin
6/11/2016 4:17 pm
I found Obama's comments pretty funny. I like him a lot, but it was all pretty hypocritical. Stating the UK should stay in the EU, when the mere thought of the US ceding any of their power to anyone external would literally cause the country to explode. Preach what you practice dude!

Like others, I'm yet to hear anything concrete and a lot of stuff from both sides appears on the surface to be nothing better than propaganda. Until I hear something solid and unbiased from a neutral source, I'm not sure either.

Re: UK leave or remain in the EU ?

By Morbid
6/14/2016 7:48 pm
WarEagle wrote:
Black Adder wrote:

...as your President has recently told us Brits how we should all vote,I wondered if you all agree with him.


On this only.

I've always thought if you don't bother to vote, you shouldn't bother to complain.


Well TBH. Voting in the US doesnt really mean a whole **** of a lot since it all boils down to delegates. You can win the popular vote for the country or even a state and still not win the amount of delegates required to be elected. It really is so confusing to break it down since each state is different as you have primaries and Caucasus which are totally different. Some states it doesnt go by the over all total vote count as it goes by counties so you could win the state election and still lose the delegates because your state values the richer counties as more than other ones. Some states require you to register Republican or Democrat and you cant change your mind even if the one in your group isnt the one you like so your stuck with that vote. Top it off you even have super delegates on the Democratic side which is total BS. I live in a small state that has 23 delegates total. That means that 24 individual people in the US can have more say than my whole state. Also just because you presumably won all the delegates in certain states when the primaries do come up that doesnt mean that all states have to award those delegates to that person, they can change their mind and give it to someone else. When it boils down to it your vote is more to boost your ego that your doing something but really it comes down to which BS artist the higher powers want as their face.

Do some research on how powerful your vote really is. I watched a video on it for about for about 45 minutes as they broke down each state and its pretty scary how our elections are rigged and how your votes are really calculated. This video broke down each states laws as best that could be understood. So many loop holes you would think your eating Fruit Loops.

Re: UK leave or remain in the EU ?

By WarEagle
6/15/2016 1:08 pm
Morbid wrote:
WarEagle wrote:
Black Adder wrote:

...as your President has recently told us Brits how we should all vote,I wondered if you all agree with him.


On this only.

I've always thought if you don't bother to vote, you shouldn't bother to complain.


Well TBH. Voting in the US doesnt really mean a whole **** of a lot since it all boils down to delegates. You can win the popular vote for the country or even a state and still not win the amount of delegates required to be elected. It really is so confusing to break it down since each state is different as you have primaries and Caucasus which are totally different. Some states it doesnt go by the over all total vote count as it goes by counties so you could win the state election and still lose the delegates because your state values the richer counties as more than other ones. Some states require you to register Republican or Democrat and you cant change your mind even if the one in your group isnt the one you like so your stuck with that vote. Top it off you even have super delegates on the Democratic side which is total BS. I live in a small state that has 23 delegates total. That means that 24 individual people in the US can have more say than my whole state. Also just because you presumably won all the delegates in certain states when the primaries do come up that doesnt mean that all states have to award those delegates to that person, they can change their mind and give it to someone else. When it boils down to it your vote is more to boost your ego that your doing something but really it comes down to which BS artist the higher powers want as their face.

Do some research on how powerful your vote really is. I watched a video on it for about for about 45 minutes as they broke down each state and its pretty scary how our elections are rigged and how your votes are really calculated. This video broke down each states laws as best that could be understood. So many loop holes you would think your eating Fruit Loops.


I agree that our method of voting needs to be changed.

In case you are interested, this is my preferred method.
Range Voting: http://rangevoting.org/

Another good method is the Alternative Vote: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Y3jE3B8HsE

Re: UK leave or remain in the EU ?

By jsid
6/24/2016 2:55 am
Man, I thought the US was in bad shape with Trump vs. Hillary. I checked the result when I woke up in the middle of the night and you're PM quit, Northern Ireland and Scotland are about to secede, and 5% of my life savings is gone.

Last edited at 6/24/2016 2:57 am

Re: UK leave or remain in the EU ?

By martinwarnett
6/24/2016 10:32 am
NI and Scotland aren't seceding.

Scotland had a referendum on that and chose to remain.

The SNP leader Sturgeon is like a hyperactive munchkin / oompa loompa hybrid. Like Mel Gibson in Braveheart but with a more ridiculous accent.

Basically wants referendums until gets result she wants....

Anyhoo, Scotland will be in trouble is they leave the UK. They do have North Sea oil - price of which has fallen and if they do leave, they won't retain 100% of it anyway. They, like Wales and England receive funding each year according to a Barnett formula - sadly, this is flawed meaning Scotland get more per head then Wales or England and disproportionately so. They'd lose that money.

Sturgeon's financial plans following independence already have gaping holes in terms of the funding - they'll be bankrupt within a year.

Plan to join the EU? Depends if they are wanted. Spain will object - they would be concerned abut their Catalan region wanting to up and leave also.

Assuming they get into the EU, they'll almost certainly have to ditch the pound sterling ( they seem to believe they can retain the UK currency if they secede ). That means harmonising with the Euro and, well, see Greece for the example of trying to homogenise disparate economies.

Scotland export 90% of trade to England. Want to leave the UK? Join the EU? Well, they'll lose freedom of travel, visas being required. They'll also have trade tariffs applied.

The problem in the Uk was the Remain camp want to simplify it to "whoever votes to leave is clearly racist". Which is ****. Controlled immigration via an Australian style model is what is needed; skilled workers in rather than unskilled.

The problem is that back in 1975 when the UK joined the European Community, it was established as purely a trading block. A European NAFTA. The problem is that over time it's become a creeping socialist experiment. Let's integrate politically. Let's have control over justice system. let's have a common currency. Unlike the USA, the political, economic, cultural and language differences are too vast and wide to have a "one size fits all approach".

The EU can issue things called "directives". These can apply to all nations or be targetted at specific nations. So, EU may pass a directive at Britain to say ensure all food produce is in pink and green coloured wrappers. ( Deliberately using a farcical example ).

Nations targetted by the directives are given the end result. They have freedom to implement laws to achieve that end result. However, they have to implement those rules to fulfill the directive. if they don't or have a poor law then the EU can refer that nation to the European Court of Justice.

It's a horrendously overly red taped undemocratic... thing.

Cameron renegotiated a deal. Within days, EU officials mocked the deal, European leaders mocked the deal, we were told "no further renegotiation". When the prime Minister had to try to sell the Remain vote to people, the Eu couldn't even throw him a bone, any form of sweetener.

If it had purely been kept as a trading block, I'd have agreed to vote Remain with reservations. What idiots at the EU want is a "United States of Europe"... which nobody in Europe really wants. EU have now lost the then 5th biggest world economy, 2nd biggest net contributor ( and I'm sure Germany will now be happy at having to subsidise everybody with little help ) and the largest military force in Europe.